< 1 2 3 4 >  Last ›
2 of 9
Messier for Elmore
Posted: 03 February 2007 07:01 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]
Administrator
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  608
Joined  2005-01-10

Robb:

Your e-mail account is bouncing.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 03 February 2007 11:07 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]
Power User
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  355
Joined  2006-09-20

I hear the demand from out there
that’s the reason we have this forum
to state the demand and
to perhaps understand
the rules well enough
to fulfill the demand
ourselves
and give the master more time to consider our next best move
Robb
Check out
http://www.johnmcfetridge.ca/index_files/Page410.htm

Profile
 
 
Posted: 03 February 2007 07:31 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]
Power User
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  485
Joined  2005-10-08
Gregg Sutter - 03 February 2007 12:01 PM

Robb:

Your e-mail account is bouncing.

Fixed!  Too much spam.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 17 February 2007 03:56 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 19 ]
Power User
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  355
Joined  2006-09-20

Now reading The Big Bounce
still in Elmore Time
most pleasant task daily a meditation

Rule No.1 While reading the book
you can read anything else
as long as you keep on reading the book
Rule No. 2 Keep your eyes open for historical references
people place events and check them out, Google search them
put yourself in the story

“They were watching Ryan beat up the Mexican crew leader on 16mm Commercial Ektachrome”
In the basement of the Holden County Michigan courthouse”

The voice of the no name narrator is back interrupted by the dialogue

There are two Franks in this story
Young Jack’s brother in law, Frank, who sits at the kitchen table and eats
Frank Pizarro is some mysterious lynchpin from the dark people file
one grows one dies

Image Attachments
The Big Bounce Thorndike LP.jpg
Profile
 
 
Posted: 27 April 2007 04:11 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 20 ]
Power User
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  355
Joined  2006-09-20

Messier for Elmore
This is a bit of a break in the routine of Elmore Time
A Meditation, a time zone of the mind, so step back
Assuming you have started at the top of this column,
If you have you must know that every Elmore novel contains a love story that is so pure and fine that it will ennoble humanity sufficiently to allow it to survive the ordeal it will soon embark upon.
If you haven’t, you may not have entered into the spirit of this endeavor,
I began work with a simple discipline and have allowed it to express itself,
With your encouragement,
I invite you to follow some of the trains of thought evoked by this event,
Digging deeply to honour the storyteller and learn from him.
Themes and Touchstones
In a sense the accumulated wisdom of reading these works in this order lays open a foundation of real observation against which things in focus become sharp and things out of focus clarify. Look at the power building in the tensions of five great stories of the old west, what made it wild, who were these people and why they were there.
Each title deals with broad themes, Bounty, Law, Escape, The Last Stand, Hombre
Look for the Civil War references, a constant historic structure is a marked trait of the mature Leonard right up to Honey’s Room.
Follow the “bad guys” named Frank
Rules of reading in chronologic order
The first rule of reading in Elmore Time is to keep reading the book,
Once you start this meditation,
Accept this time zone of the mind,
Start the reading at The Bounty Hunters and proceed to read each book with an open mind and heart. You will begin to notice small distractions sooner or later. Another book will come along that has to be read. I received Advanced Reader thingies from Gregg and John McFeteridge whilst reading Last Stand at Saber River and How the Irish Saved Civilization. No trouble really, I kept reading the Messier book in those familiar moments of meditation, mostly late at night just before turning out the light or in the tub with a Jim Beam.
I read the others during the day; sometimes to stop doing whatever it is I’ve been doing,  Up in Honey’s Room, as Robb would say “Oh My God”. I don’t really know how many books a person can read all at the same time, it doesn’t really matter, all part of the journey in time.
So rule two has to be; be careful not to start another book in the time between finishing and starting Messier books and even though I have taken this opportunity to mark the passing of a group by posting the whole block I continue to read, savor,  the next one, The Big Bounce, the first one in the next group. Read on.
Groups
The 5 Western Novels
The Bounty
The Law
Escape
Last Stand
Hombre

A note related to the insane genius of djones, like django, derives a personal expression in the context of his culture, where point of view is honoured and mutual respect is afforded, the quote from movie adaptation thread Freaky Deaky.
Quote “The Slater Family has sent me an under-the-table invite to work for them, trying to sell fake green cards to Frenchies, but little did they know I already have (under an alias, of course)” A confession to a profession of truth seekers
has to do with a widening of the fascination some of us have for the writings of Elmore Leonard and how they effect our own expressions of truth as we know it. We may not know the truth when we hear it but we do know what we like, I invite you to write what you know or think you know and hang pretensions or genre. If you do such a thing you will take the time to read these works and comment on them as is your delight.
Check out a new review of Hombre
http://www.helium.com/tm/294200

Profile
 
 
Posted: 28 April 2007 10:15 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 21 ]
Power User
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  204
Joined  2007-02-04

It seems clear to me that Mr Slater is setting me up as an “insane genius” only to be able to knock me down again & steal what he thinks are my laurels. I’m certainly in a vulnerable position, a fairly old retired person occupying some of his time on this marvelous Forum, but understandably (to me) keeping one eye over his shoulder for all the Eng. Lit. types who’re going to start coming along in a few years to turn this interchange of passion & humanity into one of their ghastly “resources”.

For example I’ve been confused for a long time by this ‘Messier’ thing. I know it’s about Ted Messier the hockey player & I think I discern vaguely the principle at stake & yet & yet… I have to admit something almost terrible about myself (I said I was vulnerable): I haven’t read any of the Western stuff at all. Well, I did read one of the novels to see what they were like, but I can’t even remember which one it was now. I’m going to remedy this very soon, put in a big order to Amazon.

But try as I might there is one thing here I don’t grasp. I want to admire Mr Slater for his purity of purpose, & not ironise & ridicule all the time & even allow his (very gentle) spamming of this Forum, nevertheless there is one proposition in this that has me in total bewilderment:

The first rule of reading in Elmore Time is to keep reading the book.


All I can say is:  ?

 Signature 

A shiny brown lowrider dachshund named Swifty

Profile
 
 
Posted: 30 April 2007 06:44 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 22 ]
Power User
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  355
Joined  2006-09-20

Nay Sir say it ain’t so
that the sum total of ones work
in this life
is not worth
an exhaustive effort
to derive from it
it’s utmost essence
the possibility that one of us can succeed
to connect diverse cultures
to tell a good story
Your laurels are that you write well,
nay
beautifully
Why not use them for the good
The true
a) Mark Messier was the hockey player
right John? Are you thinking of Ted Linsay of the Red Wing Kid Line of the 50’s?
b) Charles Messier dedicated his life
of some considerable circumstances,
as you folk in Europe might say,
to the ennumeration of smudges in the night sky
out of appreciation of his contribution to the knowledge of man
we read the smudes in the sky in some order
so one can read Elmore in time
Start at the first and read thru chronologically to the last
So keep reading has to be the first rule otherwise the task will remain undone
then only the truth will do
so when you do get around to reading the westerns in order
you will see that some disscussion
of ongoing themes
of social justice
structure the work
throughout
without sacrificing the story or the history
One of the genius things Dutch does is remain true to the time he is writing about
so it makes sense to devise a means to chronical that progress
Thus Elmore Time
not to be confused with an Elmore Complex
Thanks for reading the article in Helium
http://www.helium.com/tm/294200
Note again this is not spam but a relevent fold in the the discource of the forum
Hombre in it’s way was the watershed
The Big Bounce as mentioned above
although true in time is more of Elmore’s time
again a personal journy as opposed to the impersonal
crime puzzle that carries all the Detroit Florida axis
If you leave off your bluster and keep reading
you too will see the logic in all this
say Sir it’s so

Profile
 
 
Posted: 24 May 2007 10:23 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 23 ]
Power User
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  355
Joined  2006-09-20

Wow that was a big bounce eh
some kind of battle with the evil lord
yet here we are again
finished the Big Bounce
there was a spot there when Jack Ryan thinks of Nancy Hayes
“He couldn’t imagine her not at ease. But she could be faking it.
It was still talking and not doing and there were a few miles of nerve between the two.”

in the Last Stand recall a face to face between the top boss Vern Kidston,
whose brother Major Duane is still at war and stands with Bill Dancey, Joe Bob, Royce, carbine rifle in hand,
in the front yard of the hombre rebel war veteran Paul Cable.
“Cable moved the Walker from Duane to Vern.
“How does it look now?”
Vern seemed almost to smile.
“There’s seven mile of nerve between pointing a gun and pulling the triger”

A search for the finer self

Started The Moonshine War,
the quiet anti-hero Son Martin home from the war
Frank Long still at war on stills, another bad guy Frank
after 5 novels and many short stories in southern Arizona
then the resort thumb of Michigan, during a time the Tigers ruled
a small town in the hollows of eastern Kentucky
this seems a folk tale, legend, after the flood, June 1931
Dr. Taulbee, depraved dentist
Dual Meaders, got his start by dropping a rock on the head of the school bully
Milely Mitchell, prototypical Honey Deal, Frank even started calling her Honey after he has his way with her
what a gang they are, really enjoying the read
this is a movie review I wrote somehow without seeing the movie
http://www.helium.com/tm/201674/movie-reviews-large-about

Profile
 
 
Posted: 25 May 2007 09:25 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 24 ]
Power User
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  349
Joined  2006-08-03

Just placed a big order with Amazon.  Moonshine is out of print apparently.  Will have to settle for something used.  Went this time with a bunch of early westerns and Gold Coast.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 27 May 2007 08:29 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 25 ]
Power User
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  204
Joined  2007-02-04

I admitted a while ago that I’ve only ever read one of the western books, to see what it was like, & that was long ago & I’ve even forgotten which one it was. Westerns never turned me on. However, I’ve just received my big order from Amazon (it was no problem getting a used copy of Moonshine) & here we go.

I started with the magazine stories from ‘51 & ‘52, the first seven. It’s kind of an instinct,  second-guessing the author & making the comparison with later work. You have to try to resist it. Anyway, it’s not difficult - it’s a rare pleasure - to watch a man starting to make his mark in the writing racket. Rising at 5a.m. maybe with a hangover & that awful taste in your mouth - you don’t even allow yourself a cup of coffee - & having to write of all things. Man, I can appreciate it.

I get the impression there are several Elmores in the writing at the moment, each one coming into focus briefly from time to time. There’s the experimenting with ‘point of view’. In some stories (e.g. ‘Trail’) each character is allotted his own block of text, rigorously. ‘Hunted Ones’, though, has the POV changing from paragraph to paragraph.

There’s the insistence on sense of place. You can imagine that if you have a picture of a scene in your mind, it’s difficult to know how much of it you want to put down in writing for the reader to be able to see the same thing. Increasing lightness of touch must be a matter not only of professional experience but of the evolution of writing in general. And not just books: movies as well. Anyway, the more you put in, the more you have the Author intruding on the story. Elmore almost manages to make himself disappear in ‘The Colonel’s Lady’; other times you see him, sometimes as a history professor (‘Cavalry Boots’), more usually as a companion telling a tale round the fire. This is hardly intrusive. Compared with other writers of the 50’s - Graham Green, or Philip Dick - it’s as stripped-down as it gets. But frequently character is carefully implied by simple descriptions of men’s faces, then needlessly (but not if you need the 2 cents a word) repeated by the intruding author. Difficult not to be anachronistic here, but the beginning of ‘Trail’ looks like it might have been written so that if it failed with the pulps it could perhaps be sold to National Geographic. But then, after 3 pages of this, right out of the blue comes a phrase, a line of dialog, & if this was a guessing game you’d have a good chance of being right on the money. It’s like only one man could have written this line, 4 pages into the collection & you know you’re going to have a good time:

                                    Go get Fry immediately. And turn out your boys.

 Signature 

A shiny brown lowrider dachshund named Swifty

Profile
 
 
Posted: 29 May 2007 05:15 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 26 ]
Power User
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  355
Joined  2006-09-20

I am pleased to be a co author of this thread as it reaches a milestone,
an esteemed Power User begins the quest for the Elmore Complex,
the most vaunted of all
Finished reading The Moonshine War
In this time now between books,
having the next one on hand
savoring the beginning
yet holding back
to savor
the one
just
finished
The Moonshine War rings a bell on the costs of war, oh the glory of right and wrong
The rules of reading as I see it now need clarification

Rule No.1 While reading the book
you can read anything else
as long as you keep on reading the book The first rule of reading in Elmore Time is to keep reading the book,
Once you start this meditation,
Accept this time zone of the mind,
Start the reading at The Bounty Hunters and proceed to read each book with an open mind and heart. You will begin to notice small distractions sooner or later. Another book will come along that has to be read. I received Advanced Reader thingies from Gregg and John McFeteridge whilst reading Last Stand at Saber River and How the Irish Saved Civilization. No trouble really, I kept reading the Messier book in those familiar moments of meditation, mostly late at night just before turning out the light or in the tub with a Jim Beam.
I read the others during the day; sometimes to stop doing whatever it is I’ve been doing, Up in Honey’s Room, as Robb would say “Oh My God”. I don’t really know how many books a person can read all at the same time, it doesn’t really matter, all part of the journey in time.

Rule No. 2 Keep your eyes open for historical references
people place events and check them out, Google search them
put yourself in the story

So Rule Three has to be; be careful not to start another book in the time between finishing and starting Messier books and even though I have taken this opportunity to mark the passing of a group by posting the whole block I continue to read, savor, the next one, Valdez is Coming, the first one in the next group. Read on.
Rule Three concerns bridging, having the next novel on hand and at the ready, noting what happens to previous volumes, how close to hand they stay and why. While not absolutely necessary and superseded by the first two, rule three ensures that in the event a failure occurs in the first two, the space between books may contain some of the most potent Dutch awareness and understanding, where the author truly is, not just where you need him to be.

Image Attachments
The Moonshine War.jpg
Profile
 
 
Posted: 30 May 2007 06:51 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 27 ]
Power User
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  427
Joined  2006-11-12

Valdez is Coming, the first western I ever read. A fantastic book. It really shows how to make it “personal,” something people talk about in vague terms way too much without saying anything.

Valdez shows how.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 30 May 2007 10:00 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 28 ]
Power User
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  349
Joined  2006-08-03

Valdez was my first EL western too.  Great stuff. 
Looking forward to jumping back into that world again shortly. 
Enjoy the ride esteemed Sr. Member Slater.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 30 May 2007 08:32 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 29 ]
Power User
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  355
Joined  2006-09-20

Right away I am amazed at the continuity of set from the end of Moonshine to the beginning of Valdez, the community out overseeing an event, some hillside out in the country where all the people come to see what is happening, the loss of a precious commodity and the death of an innocent.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 30 May 2007 09:43 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 30 ]
Power User
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  485
Joined  2005-10-08
son slater - 31 May 2007 12:32 AM

Right away I am amazed at the continuity of set from the end of Moonshine to the beginning of Valdez, the community out overseeing an event, some hillside out in the country where all the people come to see what is happening, the loss of a precious commodity and the death of an innocent.

That is an excellent observation.  Rock on. 

I love the first scene in VALDEZ.  It is an expansion of “Only Good Ones” from COMPLETE WESTERNS.

Profile
 
 
   
 < 1 2 3 4 >  Last ›
2 of 9